"Sometimes you can start the program with one set of questions, and then changes occur, and those questions no longer apply, while other ones arise. Share your learning experiences."

Anatoliy Dudinsky: I am the CEO of Amo Pictures. We produce content in various formats, including films and series for digital platforms in English. When it comes to expectations, I joined this program because in December 2023, I transitioned into the CEO role from the position of operational director, and I didn’t understand what I was supposed to do. I needed both practical and theoretical knowledge.

Why did my expectations change during the program? First and foremost, it became clear that you cannot address all questions with one program. This program is merely an entry point. After it, you realize that your top team also needs to be involved in some programs, because you can’t communicate different messages to them that you’re taking from here.

Iryna Slavinska: I have worked in media since I was 19, starting as a blogger and freelancer, and since 2018, I have joined the team of Radio "Kultura," where I am now the executive director, managing a team of 54 people. We are members of the European Broadcasting Union and the only team in the country creating cultural content that airs on global public broadcasters. If you listen to France Culture, some of the programs feature recordings from Lysenko that our team created.

2022 was a significant challenge for us. We had always been a Ukrainian-language station, with no Russians among our audience. But suddenly, we realized that we started to interact with others through our gadgets. People who, perhaps for the first time in their lives, said: “If I’m not listening to Tchaikovsky, what will I listen to now? If I’m not reading Dostoevsky, what will I read now?” We are learning to work with this public. It’s an interesting challenge.

I entered the training with one hypothesis and came out with something entirely different than I had imagined. I had a question about my intuitive approach to my work. I had great teachers, previous editors, and producers to rely on, but I wasn't sure if I was doing things correctly. Part of my training request was that I lacked not just humanities knowledge, but, for instance, knowledge about numbers. However, my request was not fulfilled, because it turned out that the question was entirely different.

The training pushed me to focus not on numbers or hard skills, but on reflections about the value our team creates. I am still in these reflections. This ongoing reflection since the beginning of the training greatly nourishes my work today. I could not have imagined how much strength this gives. It has brought concrete changes in delegation, structure, planning, and reporting.

Anatoliy Troshin: I am the CEO of the IT company Banza. We implement platforms for automating business processes primarily around the customer: communication platforms, sales, marketing, etc. We have experience with projects on all continents. Regarding my inquiry: it’s great when you have good teachers along your life path. During eight years of working as a top manager, I had none. You learn through your practical experience and mistakes. Nine months before becoming the CEO, I learned about the CEO Development Program, which I attended to understand what awaits me in this position and what other people in other businesses do. During the program, I gained peace because now I understand what I need for my job.

The experience at kmbs is fantastic because you communicate with a very broad audience. Sometimes you can be inspired while talking to someone from a global company with 11,000 employees. My expectations changed from acquiring practical knowledge to a point where you leave after three days of training and realize that over the next month, your brain will be stretched with new insights and ideas.

I remember the instructors saying that perhaps we wouldn’t understand some topics right away. Only after months did I find myself with questions that I had to first answer for myself and then think about how to communicate them to my team. Because the team was also asking: “What are you studying? Show us your presentation.” So, coming out of this program, I realized that a new journey had begun. Previously, I thought I would receive the foundation and just start working with it.

"Let’s recall, as they say at Mohyla, specific topics and things that you managed to implement and that worked or yielded certain results. Perhaps there was a valuable insight that went into practice."

Anatoliy Troshin: We had a module with Serhiy Nozdriachov about self-identity. When we completed it, I realized my own talents. This was a super insight that I took away from the program as one of the most important, which I now rely on. It’s about understanding your strengths and that they should be prioritized.

Why do I say this is a practical tool? Because afterward, I went into the company and looked at the goals of our employees for the upcoming six months. The company culture often suffocates, as you are constantly expected to keep up. No one focuses on what you are actually good at. This was practical work we did with all departments. I explained that people need to talk about what they excel at and be encouraged to do so always. The focus on weaknesses needed to be discarded. This kind of change wasn't present before in our company, and it’s still ongoing because people find it difficult; they always want to look at the negatives and figure out how to address them. Focusing on positives is one of the coolest things I took away from the program.

*Iryna Slavinska: For me, it’s about the Jobs to be Done framework—identifying the jobs that need to be done for your client. It was really interesting to look at what we do from a different angle. Previously, I thought about standards, primary sources, and handling information. These are all aspects that don’t dismiss the Jobs to be Done perspective but rather add another layer. Since then, I’ve started to think more about this. Previously, our audience was considered from different terms and different words.

Changing the frame truly helps. For example, a talented author joined our team, who runs one of the most popular English-language accounts on Twitter about Ukrainian artists (Ukrainian Art History), often reposted by The New York Times. Oksana Semenyuk, a young researcher, came to us asking to do a project on art. Radio is an audio genre. It’s hard to talk about visual arts. So for us, it was a challenge. We discussed extensively what we would do for our audience besides what we wanted.

As a result, we delved into discussions about the falsified history of Ukrainian art, about names in art that were appropriated, distorted, or silenced by Russians. This gave us an understanding of the time frame since we are discussing not just the USSR but also the Russian Empire. This narrative approach to telling the history of Ukraine mimics a biographical method.

This product became super popular. It has excellent metrics in the podcast. Now we are launching a second season with short radio blogs, where each episode is one minute long, and we didn’t even imagine that creating something small could yield such a good response.

Another thing we managed to implement is a deeper understanding of myself as a leader. Deep down, I suspected that I needed to operate in spaces where I perform well. Thus, I delegated tasks in the team at Radio "Kultura" to people who are knowledgeable about them. For example, artists handling paperwork is not their forte. So there were specialized people in the team who dealt with documentation, while others created. In fact, after the module dedicated to our qualities as leaders and the qualities of the people we work with, I realized that my intuitive approach was correct. Because for those working with documentation, it is easier when they only have to do this, without the pressure to innovate or create.

This helped me approach my leadership qualities more mindfully. Now it’s about calm, quiet leadership without loud, attention-seeking actions that sometimes disturbed me. I realized that I needed to calm down, not manipulate, and work within realms where things are already functioning well.

Anatoliy Dudinsky: For me, everything regarding Serhiy Nozdriachov and the focus on strengths also resonates. I realized that business is done through people. This block is very important; it may sometimes seem insignificant, but it’s the foundation on which the company is built. Additionally, we adopted practical approaches for assessing the company's viability and planning its strategic horizons, and we changed our financial accounting.

“How do you implement new knowledge into your team's work? They don’t communicate in kmbs metaphors, but you want to explain and convey something. How did you overcome these barriers?”

Anatoliy Dudinsky: After the first module, I began gathering my team and just sharing and explaining the things we discussed during the training. Hence, my team understood everything that was happening. Then, we worked with our HR director to figure out what exactly we would implement and began preparing for it. For example, there was a topic about Lean during the training, and we will be implementing it starting this year.

When I saw that there were three-day programs, I began to send my team to them. These were courses in sales, finance, and later operations. This way, they wouldn’t be able to work differently.

But surely some team members were resistant to what you learned here.

Anatoliy Dudinsky: You always realize who in your team has a low ability to change. So you communicate differently with people. You need to explain the value you create for that person.

Anatoliy Troshin: We didn’t encounter any resistance. This is a good investment, but the changes don’t come quickly. You explain some things over several stages. We had a lecture on change agents in the company—people with high change agility. You need to work with them first, and then it will be cascaded down.

Of course, this is a cultural issue, but resistance to change is normal. We heard this many times during the seven modules of the program. It takes time for everyone to come to a common understanding. From practical experience, I’ve learned that if you’ve made the effort a few times and people don’t accept it, perhaps there is a question about your idea’s value. You need to verify your concepts, no matter how great they seem to you once you leave that auditorium.

Iryna Slavinska: My strategy was not to say: “Now we are doing what I learned at business school.” At the same time, we often meet as a team, doing certain checkpoints every few days to sync up.

At some point, I started discreetly implementing new ideas. The team was given more opportunities to plan independently, knowing they could always ask for clarification or advice. This was a significant change.

A second major change occurred when I began to connect people from different editorial departments, helping them find themselves in situations where they had to collaborate. This yielded significant results.

Elena Maltseva's lectures helped me define differently in discussions what we want to offer our audience, our client. Sometimes the client is within the editorial team, and they need to sell the changes we plan to implement. The vocabularies, approaches, and tools that Elena shared with us assisted in this.

Implementing new practices was not easy; however, it turned out to work well.

Anatoliy Dudinsky: Interestingly, during training, we talked a lot about people, personal meetings, and the importance of meaningful conversations with colleagues. I managed to implement this. The key is to have conversations about the person, their goals, what they completed, what they didn’t complete, what hinders them, and what helps. It’s not about their duties.

“You mentioned communication with the team. Were there instances when something needed to change in the company, but the owner didn’t share that initiative?”

Anatoliy Dudinsky: We had a significant discussion about understanding what the company needs versus what the owner needs. I went through a phase where we discussed what the owners needed for the business and where what the company needed began. After that, it became much easier.

Anatoliy Troshin: This was a very important question that I hadn’t realized until the program. After the training, I had a meeting with the owner. If you’re a passionate leader, you enter the program, fully dedicate yourself, and at some point, say: “Listen, now we turn around, and we do it differently.” This is a very crucial point.

Anatoliy Dudinsky: In our group, there were people who, by the end of the program, realized that the company would not allow them to implement changes, so they were considering changing jobs. This program offers a clear understanding of what a CEO is. If you lack what a CEO should have to operate effectively, sometimes it may be necessary to consider a job change.

“What communication did you have with your classmates outside of the classroom? What value does this communication bring? What is its element of value?”

Anatoliy Dudinsky: The group indeed provides a lot because in life, you communicate with people from your business or those doing something similar. Our group was incredibly diverse: people from energy, agriculture, media, manufacturing. This is a valuable experience. When you have practical work in groups, you learn a lot about other businesses: how they operate, what works differently, what you can adopt, and what you can do with that. Therefore, the group is an important asset. You might not even communicate much, but you know that in your contacts are people you can reach out to if you need help.

Iryna Slavinska: If you engage in defending homework during everyone’s presentations, you can learn more about how other businesses operate. Completing this task together with instructors allows for deeper reflection. For me, this part was extraordinarily valuable. The diversity in the group is a colossal resource. The backgrounds you gain after the training provide interesting support to work with afterward.

Anatoliy Troshin: There’s a myth about practical classes: that it’s not good if your group consists of companies from agriculture, manufacturing, and you are from IT. That’s really not the case. If there are practical tasks and you have a case from a manufacturing company, you will undoubtedly find something for yourself. I’ve never regretted the time spent in a session. You always learn something valuable from the cases of other companies. On the contrary, it’s beneficial to expand one's perspective.

Our group established a separate community that meets every six months. There was a case when a colleague suggested we analyze her work case. We gathered, rented a coworking space, and worked on it. This leaves you with connections and conversations that are quite inspiring, and it’s very valuable to exchange thoughts with people who are currently dealing with the same problems.

“How can training be made more effective? Seven months is not a short period, but time flies by quickly. Some things might just not be accomplished or pay attention to. If you could go back to the beginning of your studies, what advice would you give yourself?”

Iryna Slavinska: I would ask more questions, but this probably goes against my nature since I like to receive a mass of information first and then dissect it.

If you are a bit shy, it’s better to switch that off and interact more with the instructors. You can gain a lot of valuable insights from this. Throughout the training, there will be opportunities for additional conversations, like meetings with Serhiy Nozdriachov.

Another piece of advice is to take notes. In Ukrainian educational culture, this is underrated. Don’t fall for the illusion that they are sharing simple and obvious things, because in reality, that’s not the case. So take notes, even the simplest ones. Cultivating a note-taking culture should be a priority if you don't already have one.

Anatoliy Troshin:  I would allow myself time for reflection on what occurred during each module. When there are 5-7 modules layered on top of each other, this reflection becomes very challenging, and it’s important to secure the material earlier.

If you want to learn something, devote time to it. Ask questions and engage with the cases. It’s excellent to present your examples during the training. When you talk about something, you become more aware that the idea you had in your head may not be as great as you thought. Sometimes I practice this within the company. Because in my head it seems awesome, but then I speak, and it turns out it’s not the case.

There’s also a great concept called sketchnoting, drawing in a notebook. When you don’t write, but instead draw simple illustrations. Now when I look at those, they immediately bring me back into context.

Anatoliy Dudinsky: Don't get caught up in work during training. Those pauses to check your phone or respond to a lot of messages really disrupt your focus. Meanwhile, the dynamics in groups are very quick, and it’s hard to catch up.

Iryna Slavinska:

It means a lot to abandon the illusion of your own omnipotence and irreplaceability. Significant changes happen in the team when we realize that we don’t need to control everything happening around us. You don’t need to manage every process. You should be responsible for the whole outcome. And allow people to do their jobs the way they do it. If they do it well, there's no need to intervene in those processes.

It’s necessary to step aside and think of yourself not as Prometheus, bearing light to everyone else but as someone who creates a certain space. I give colleagues space to realize their possibilities. In that moment, many wonders may occur, and for me, that’s one of the lessons learned in this program: to think of a leadership position in the team not as a subject that gathers and leads everything, but as a space. Sometimes it’s about being the space that doesn’t hinder, doesn’t cast shadows, doesn’t consume, but rather allows a person to work.